[Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form

Peter Shorett pshorett at gvakm.com
Mon Mar 24 16:36:33 EDT 2008

V15's at NOOD would not happen without HS support, there simply are not
be enough boats/sailors in the Seattle Portland area to make it work.  

Burke and Scott have been huge supporters of stepping out of the box by
bringing boats for these events.  Burke has said he is bringing 5 boats
on a trailer to NOOD, with a few HS sailors leaving a few boats
available for HS alum or other invitees.  I don't know what Scott is up
to, but with a poke and a prod......  We also have the help of Dean from
Portland who is rallying that fleet, although they probably will not
bring more than a couple boats (right Dean?).  And you get me, Zig and
maybe a few other boats from PMYC.

Big thanks go to Burke and Scott who have helped tremendously in
establishing V15 presence at higher caliber regattas.  For CYC One
Design in October 2006, they brought 10 or so boats on a trailer and
packed 'em with HS sailors and alums.  With the other boats, I think we
had 13 boats registered and on the water.  At SOCKS in 2007, we had a
similar turn out, and at the PCC's in the Gorge, we had an even higher
caliber 20 boat regatta with numerous college level sailors and adults,
and a few HS kids - Stellmacher, Renehan, for example.

Continued success of the V15 Fleet can not rely on just a couple of
people person waving the flag - others to step up.  This is still a
fleet in development - without HS support, it will loose one of its
primary drivers.

The progress in HS Sailing's development is hindered because it lacks an
active double handed class that better matches HS & college sailing
programs than Tasars, the only real active double handed boat with any
energy in the NW area.  Travel around the country, there are plenty of
quality regattas for 420's or FJ's.  Given the critical mass of V15's
under HS related ownership, why not make that the dominate class to put
HS kids in?  I count 40+ V15's in the HS Sailing system and another 20
non HS owned boats in the Seattle area, plus Portland's 15 or so boats.
That's a pretty good fleet right there! 

I am very happy to see that the listserve is alive and well, and that
people are using it to express their interest in V15 sailing.  Let's put
this energy to good use and develop the V15 Class into something where
we will want to pay the $75 dollars to go race!


-----Original Message-----
From: hebardmf at myuw.net [mailto:hebardmf at myuw.net] 
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 11:44 AM
To: Trunkey, Steve - CKJH
Cc: Peter Shorett; DB; PNW_V15
Subject: Re: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form

Well said by Steve.  I suspect the Port Townsend and Port Angeles fleets
have the same sentiments.

We still don't have the immediate question answered:  Are there 10 (or
6) V15s that will register for this, excluding the High School Programs
as part of the 10 (or 6)?

Maybe 6, probably not 10.

I wonder if a NOOD V15 fleet can form without enlisting the help of the
High School Programs.

-- Matt

On Mon, 24 Mar 2008, Trunkey, Steve -  CKJH wrote:

> It seems maybe some further clarification might be useful.  My
> are not negativity, but rather just reflecting where our program and
> several others are at this point.  We are not affiliated with any
> club or other wealthy organization, and our kids are typically raw
> beginners who have come to our program as teenagers with no previous
> sailing experience.  So, a student who stepped into a boat for the
> time in their lives three weeks ago doesn't have National
> US Sailing membership, and competing against year round programs with
> paid coaches in mind.
> I think it's great that those opportunities are out there for kids,
> we aren't there yet.
> However, I think we should want to expand the sport so that kids like
> ours might ultimately get there - maybe at the collegiate level and
> someday buying their own boat, etc.  That means opening the "higher
> level of competition" up to all kids.  Maybe if we really want them to
> have membership in US Sailing we could make the total fee for this
> regatta $25 for high school sailors and they could come away with both
> the experience of high level competition and membership in the
> organization.  Know also that operating a community based sailing
> program takes hundreds of hours already, so every added complication
> such as raising funds for one regatta, represents a formidable
> challenge.
> ________________________________
> From: Peter Shorett [mailto:pshorett at gvakm.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 9:15 AM
> To: Trunkey, Steve - CKJH; DB; PNW_V15
> Subject: RE: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form
> I am a little surprised that there is such negative discussion on
> The reason for encouraging teams to attend these types of events is to
> raise the level of competition - to expose sailors to a higher level
> competition.  Last year, we heavily promoted the V15 PCC's in the
> There were 20+ boats, with some of the best sailors in the area
> competing and teams actually came up from California.
> Having been to several HS National Championships myself and watching
> kids generally get clobbered (that's putting in mildly), teams in the
> District have to expand their sailing horizons' from their local
> There have been many great sailors pass through the ranks of the NW
> District; they have all become great sailors by participating in
> regattas that take them to the next level like NOOD (formerly SOCKS),
> Sears Cup, Bemis, Laser NA's, etc.
> Most all of your competition (every other HS outside of the NW
> is doing this and more.  Many schools have full time paid coaches,
> round sailing conditions and top cabin competition.  Certainly the NW
> District sailing program is much better off in terms of regatta
> scheduling and clinics that it was 5 years ago, but if teams in the
> District HS do not continue to embrace a greater playing field, then
> development of the program will falter.
> If its about $$'s, then consider contacting your local yacht club for
> sponsorship (even if they are not a member), contact the Sailing
> Foundation (I bet they would be willing to sponsor a kid who finds the
> cost of entry prohibitive) or better yet, put it in your HS Sailing
> budget.
> Hope to see you all there.  And if you need a boat to sail, let me or
> Burke know, he has a trailer load of them.
> Peter
> ________________________________
> From: pnw-v15-bounces at myfleet.org [mailto:pnw-v15-bounces at myfleet.org]
> On Behalf Of Trunkey, Steve - CKJH
> Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 7:45 AM
> To: DB; PNW_V15
> Subject: Re: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form
> I believe Matt is correct. Speaking for the Central Kitsap Team, I
> guess the difference would be somewhere between 0 and 6 boats from our
> program.  If it's expensive and requires membership in US Sailing we
> likely won't be there.  CK, like many of the high school programs, is
> community based program.  We have kids from modest upbringings that
> found even the $79 registration fee for 3 months of sailing expensive.
> Some of these kids will catch the sailing fever, become successful
> working adults, and eventually become leaders in the sailing
> For now, we should be drawing them into the sport and making it
> accessible.
> As for the social ticket - it looks like a good deal for me
> but I'm not likely to take high school kids into the typical yacht
> social setting.  We would race and head home and eat from our brown
> bags.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pnw-v15-bounces at myfleet.org [mailto:pnw-v15-bounces at myfleet.org
> <mailto:pnw-v15-bounces at myfleet.org> ] On Behalf Of hebardmf at myuw.net
> Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2008 11:18 PM
> To: Peter Shorett
> Cc: pnw-v15 at myfleet.org
> Subject: Re: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form
> Uhh, did we need to be members to US Sailing for SOCKS last year? What
> about the CGRA One-Design? CYC Seattle One-Design? Turkey Bowl? If we
> did, I guess I owe someone some $$.... But all that is beside the
> Here's the real issue for "the fleet":
> Can the V15 fleet get 6 boats/skippers registered, who are members of
> Sailing, prior to April 28th (after the 28th there is a $50 late fee
> it becomes ridiculously expensive then) WITHOUT having to rely on High
> School Sailors to be some of the 6 boats? If the V15 fleet can, then
> MAYBE the V15s will have there own start. Or, maybe V15s will start
> another fleet (Tasars) and be scored separately. If the V15ers want to
> be assured their own start, we need 10 boats registered. (This is all
> from the NOR, paragraph 3.2). So, try to name 10 V15ers who will do
> regatta WITHOUT relying on the High School fleets (Orcas, Port
> Central Kitsap, Bainbridge, Friday Harbor, Port Angeles)...
> 1) Dean B.
> 2) Peter S.
> 3) Zig B.
> 4)?
> 5)?
> 6)?
> 7)?
> 8)?
> 9)?
> 10)?
> Kinda hard, isn't it? I like Dean's approach: make it cheaper,
> for the High School kids. That may make it more likely a fleet will
> in time. I frankly, don't know how many High School Sailors (i.e.,
> involved in the NWISA circuit) are members of US Sailing. Maybe there
> are more than I know, but I doubt it. I do know that it will be a
> sell to get some families to fork over $25 for the Youth US Sailing
> membership on top of an already hefty $75 entry fee for a TWO day
> (Read the NOR, centerboard fleets are Sat. & Sun.).
> This fleet relies on the High School crowd. We should advocate for
> as well.
> ________________________________
> From: pnw-v15-bounces at myfleet.org [mailto:pnw-v15-bounces at myfleet.org]
> On Behalf Of DB
> Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 3:11 AM
> To: PNW_V15
> Subject: Re: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form
> According to the NOR, and dialogs I've had with race organizers, the 2
> day format from SOCKS was going to be retained for the centerboard
> classes in order to facilitate HS sailor schedules.  Only keelboats
> would sail for 3 days.  The fact that the prices don't reflect this
> strikes me as an oversight.
> Dean
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Jim Lyle <jim at lylegroup.com>
> To: DB <bergstro2 at yahoo.com>; PNW_V15 <pnw-v15 at myfleet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2008 9:10:47 PM
> Subject: Re: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form
> Dean,
> I understand your concern. However, a youth US Sailing membership is
> only $25 and only the skipper needs to apply. If the youth wants to
> in any US Sailing championship, including the local Junior Olympics in
> August they will need to be members. For a three day event that makes
> the entry and membership $100. No one would complain about 3 days of
> golf costing that much. It's certainly cheaper than 3 days of snow
> boarding. I'm not sure how you give 2 day pricing for a 3 day event.
> I'm not involved with planning the event at all. But 3 days on the
> is not cheap and then throw in social events and $33 a day doesn't
> unreasonable to me. I find it hard to go out to dinner for $33 per
> person these days.
> I'm completely with you that cost is something we need to work on to
> promote our sport. But I'm afraid the days of $25 regattas have past -
> right along with gas under $2/gallon.
> Jim Lyle
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: DB <bergstro2 at yahoo.com>
> To: PNW_V15 <pnw-v15 at myfleet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2008 12:45:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form
> I would like to explore alternative pricing.  I am drafting a letter
> the organizers expressing our concerns.  I would like to offer pricing
> alternatives.  There are a few points that are particularly
> 1. US Sailing membership - At most regattas, US Sailing membership is
> not mandatory and can be applied towards a discount for those with
> membership.  Here it works the other way around and introduces
> considerable expense.
> 2. 2 day pricing - It looks like the pricing schedule is for a 3 day
> event.
> 3. Youth pricing - I would like to see a discount for youth and HS
> sailors.
> I'm going to send it off tomorrow morning.  If you have any
> I would like to hear them.
> Dean
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: B&B Thomas <woodsong7 at centurytel.net>
> To: hebardmf at myuw.net; DB <bergstro2 at yahoo.com>
> Cc: PNW_V15 <pnw-v15 at myfleet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2008 9:09:19 AM
> Subject: Re: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form
> That kind of entry fee  for a two day regatta will make it very
> difficult
> for high school sailors to participate
> Burke
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <hebardmf at myuw.net>
> To: "DB" <bergstro2 at yahoo.com>
> Cc: "PNW_V15" <pnw-v15 at myfleet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 11:58 PM
> Subject: Re: [Pnw-v15] Seattle NOOD Entry Form
>> Hmm.  So the regatta entry fee for me is $135.00 b/c I'm not a US
> Sailing
>> member....yet.  Great.
>> On Sat, 22 Mar 2008, DB wrote:
>>> Attached is the entry form for the Seattle NOOD.  Can't wait to see
>>> everybody out there.
>>> Dean
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